# 06 Mar, 2018 09:55
the moment you have awaited is finally here! I am ready to announce the results of the 2018 survey.
First of all, thank you so much for your participations. Frankly I did not expect so many, but you totally blew my socks off: the survey received 1575 responses!
Let's dig into analysis.
Who you are:
How is this survey influencing the future of AstroBin?
On a final note, I would like to reiterate on my motivations and situation. I have a full time day job for 42 hours a week, two children aged 2 and 5, and another hobby that is not related to astronomy and is an important part of my life.
Currently I get to work on AstroBin for about 4-8 hours a week. This is not enough of course, to support a community that is this large.
In full disclosure, AstroBin more than pays for itself. It makes me solid money-on-the-side, but it's not enough to live on and support my family. I also live in one of the most expensive countries in the world, Switzerland.
My end goal is to make AstroBin profitable enough that I could dedicate myself to it entirely. I know that some people out there think of it as a money grab, but it's not: AstroBin is a work of love and I enjoy working on it, and I truly think that this community needs a tool like it, and it needs it to be the best it can be.
I am hoping that when the planned new features will be released, I can convince most of you to move to the Premium Plus plan and get me closer to making AstroBin a full time job, so that it can truly take off from there. Imagine what I could do if I worked on AstroBin 40 hours/week :-)
But please note: this is very ambitious and it will take a long time. AstroBin is, frankly, bigger than one man can handle. This is why years ago I made it open source in hopes of receiving contributions. I did receive some minor ones, but not nearly as much as I hoped.
If you can program and know or are interested in Python, Django, Docker, Celery, Elasticsearch, Postgres, etc, please head over to the source code repository and send me some pull requests :-) https://github.com/astrobin/astrobin
Thank you all for reading, I'm looking forward to reading your comments on this topic.
PS: I didn't forget that some prizes were offered for this survey. I will announce the winners soon!
# 06 Mar, 2018 10:24
Great work Salve - democracy in action |
Look forward to the updates.
# 06 Mar, 2018 10:45
Interesting ……. So the majority think it's unfair…………. yet there will be no change to IoTD to reflect this unfairness felt by over 50% of those who answered the survey….. Have I understood that correctly?
# 06 Mar, 2018 10:50
Sara WagerYes Sara, you understood correctly .
I was not surprised by the actions to take. Nor was I satisfied.
Clearly, the key question we were discussing was not posed in the survey and this conditioned the conclusions.
I could add more thoughts but, as they are against the commercial current, I prefer to reserve it for myself.
Maybe one day a different thought will arise.
# 06 Mar, 2018 10:52
Sara WagerYes. The decision is based on the fact that I don't feel that images coming from remote setups are over-represented in the IOTD (there was also some hard data to back this feeling, provided by Roberto Colombari; additionally, I plan to use the tags that I will add to actually confirm the data).
In my eyes, AstroBin should be a reflection of the astrophotography community, and it looks like only about 10% of the pictures come from remote observatories. I don't think it makes sense to segregate them.
The planned Contests Module will address those who wish to have contests for specific themes. So you can have a "April Star Party contest for the Astronomical Association XYZ", or the "Monthly low budget contests", the "Monthly AZ mount contest", or whatever.
I will re-evaluate my position after having collected some data via the new tags and seen how the themed contests go.
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:02
Thanks Ruben and Salvatore for confirming what thought I had read.|
Thank you Salvatore for taking the time and effort to make the survey and analyse the results for us.
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:21
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:23
Davide CovertaOh the irony ….. LOL!!!Paddy Gilliland
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:38
Salvatore IovenePaddy has probably not taken into account that the questions are linearly indipendent.
I mean, it's not just the 8% of the AB population that stated that it is not fair. It's the whole.
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:45
|Please consider the tags and the categorization of TP as a trial. We might extend it to IOTD in the future. Or IOTD might become obsolete because of the generic Contests Module. And my decision was not based on "feel", but on the data provided by Roberto's script, showing that remote images are not over-represented in the IOTD. Also based on the fact that 92% are not dissatisfied by the IOTD.|
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:51
Yeah, let's see how things are going on.|
I think it is reasonable to test categories in TPs. And actually in TPs - just my feeling hey - purchased data have much more weight than they have in IOTDs.
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:52
|We will know soon. I plan on adding the tags soon.|
# 06 Mar, 2018 11:55
I had read the answers and like others see the contradictions but…..
Salva has gone to the effort of conducting the survey and 'great work' was a nod to him for trying - not a conclusion on the results and outcomes.
Unfortunately, this is democracy in action (Churchill - 'democracy is the worse form of government - apart from all the others' - it means some of us get what we did not want or even expect from time to time.
The data is clear yet contradictory (which really highlights the problem across a large demographic) a decision (governance) was required and was taken as I read it. We can carry on complaining about it as much as we like or get on with the hobby and stop whining, the site is going to evolve more and some nice new features. I'll focus on those positives rather than knocking the efforts that have been made.
I am sure these features will improve the site and evolve further with time. I can live with progress
# 06 Mar, 2018 12:04
I wasn't complaining nor whining Paddy - Just seeking clarification and then making a comment.
# 06 Mar, 2018 12:45
|Great Job, Salvatore. Just carry on like this. Visiting AstroBin feels like coming home for me - even after only a few month of membership|
# 06 Mar, 2018 13:09
Great Job Salvatore!|
There are as many great opinions, as great images, and imagers here!
# 06 Mar, 2018 13:40
Sara WagerSorry I clearly misunderstood - net position at end of it was it is ironic. Maybe that is a positive I don't see
While closer to an Electocracy maybe, Salva simply went with the element that had the higher %, seems democratic to me, not really seeing the irony in that. Had he have gone the other way you could have still levelled irony as a response, as he had not gone with the 92%. Lose, lose based on that. You don't always get what you want in a democracy and sometimes governance is required to resolve contradictory requirements.
I am going to make a picture - seems like the best solution to me
# 06 Mar, 2018 14:52
Regarding the " contradictions," let me offer a theory that can make the contradiction go away.|
As the data show, most users think it is unfair for remote setup to compete with backyard/travel setup. However, what if the remote group has been given a higher bar in the IOTD selection process so it is more difficult for them to get IOTD? In such a case, although the competition starts with some unfairness, it is balanced in the selection process (this could be supported by the analyses made by Roberto ) and most of the users are OK with the outcome. And therefore at the end, most of the users do not demand a change to IOTD.
If you think along this line, then there is unnecessarily a contradiction.
# 06 Mar, 2018 16:09
Is it possible to give a percentage?
Thanks in advance,
# 06 Mar, 2018 16:27
Just for sake of curiosity, I went back to the survey.|
We have the following questions about IOTD:
0. What are your feelings about the IOTD (Image of the Day) contest? *
1. The IOTD/Top Picks something that I aspire to. *
2. The IOTD/Top Picks should always be the top quality image for that day. *
3. The IOTD/Top Picks should reward intent and effort just as much as quality. *
4. It's unfair that astrophotographers with remotely hosted setups compete for IOTD/Top Picks in the same category as backyard or travelling astrophotographers. *
5. It's unfair that astrophotographers with big budget equipment compete for IOTD/Top Picks in the same category as those with less expensive equipment. *
6. I would like to see more themed and specific contexts. *
7. The IOTD/Top Picks should be selected by a jury of industry experts that are universally recognised for their achievements. *
8. The IOTD/Top Picks should be selected by the AstroBin community via a voting process that involves as many people as possible, for democracy. *
9. I am interested in contributing to the IOTD/Top Picks selection by investing 5-10 minutes a day into it.
Where does the following conclusion come from? –>
# 06 Mar, 2018 16:30
Thanks again for this Salvatore. What a pain it must have been compiling all that data.|
I see no contradiction. Whilst a majority believe (rightly or wrongly) that some folks have an advantage over others, they still think that the best image should be IOTD. Maybe this is simply an acknowledgement of something that applies generally in life - that whilst ‘unfairness’ exists, as often as not, the solutions offered to eradicate it are worse.
# 06 Mar, 2018 17:21
Roberto Colombari37.7% said it works well
26.3% said it works well but could see minor improvements
28.1% said "don't know / don't care"
# 06 Mar, 2018 17:26
Great job |
# 06 Mar, 2018 17:34
Thanks. Now it is far more clear.|
I would read the numbers in a different way, however, otherwise it seems a plebiscite, which is not IMO.
We have 37.7% + 26.3% that we can correctly say that are satisfied about the IOTD quality (I am one of these, I really think that nearly always IOTDs are outstanding images - with some exceptions, of course).
But once asked if IOTD is fair, 2/3 of the site states "no" (and I am one of those, again).
That is why, IMHO, we should really pay attention to the exercise we are going to do for the TPs (categories) and maybe apply it to the IOTDs as well.
# 06 Mar, 2018 18:08
Then the majority of Astrobin members are going to be disappointed with the final decision, but as the site owner Salvatore of course has the final word.
It is appreciated that Salvatore has limited time to work on Astrobin and for that we must all be very grateful and for the provision of such an excellent and useful site.
We will have to see how the new ideas Salvatore has will work.
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