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I don't know if the astrobin / astrophotographer community may do something, but probably any initiative is important. If anyone here may post images showing starlink trails, it helps. Iin my opinion only the IAU may have a chance to do something. https://www.iau.org/news/announcements/detail/ann19035/ as well as the asttronomical US community.(since starlink is a US company and a major concern for professionnal survey programs, ( LSST, ASAS SN) The IDA published a statement https://www.darksky.org/why-do-mega-constellations-matter-to-the-dark-sky-community/ and you may share your concerns here : https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScoeWIIMh9WH-hEbi9eYQCavt8aO_CUDzDFAsY2-FGABPTiXg/viewform before Jan 6th The AAS will then have a special session on Jan 8th, https://www.abstractsonline.com/pp8/#!/8993/session/133 The ESO annoucement 19062 https://www.eso.org/public/announcements/ann19062/ will try to address the problem with the AAS and IAU, the intention is probably to get the UN involved Then, share your images on social networks, and tag or send to ESO, IAU, IDA, AAS as well as your national astronomical organisations (amateur or professional) and have them involved. #stopstarlink |
1.20
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Is it a loophole or open violation of the Five International Space Law Treaties (unoosa.org)? The treaty was signed and ratified into force by the US and another 108 countries 10 October 1967. The fact the satellites cannot hide will be their ultimate demise. Liability is also built into these regulations. The Internet operational aspect seems destined to backfire for all the reasons we have brought up here. The concern is that near term launches will not be stopped in time, and the aftermath leaves us stuck with abandoned space junk. There will come the "aha!" moment when it becomes noticed by the general population of the world with the information it is a long term / permanent condition. Then it stops. Perhaps it is an advantage that they cannot hide. We can continue to educate the populace and bring pressure to bear to move up this realization and save launches. Right now we are seen as just another nuisance group of myopic crackpots that will soon go away. We must rise above and be reckoned with. We must be uncommon. |
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I have signed the petition and trying to get others in our astronomical society to sign as well |
8.04
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I've just E mailed: Andrew Williams ESO External Relations Officer on the link provided above and pointed him towards this thread. Anything is worth a try. Carole |
1.20
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I sent a message to Neil deGrasse Tyson about it on the low chance it gets processed. Surely he is aware anyway and has embraced the cause as an associate of The American Museum of Natural History. I will continue attempts to get organizational signators of those affected. |
1.20
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I sent the petition and orienting information to Anna Sidorenko of UNESCO. She is part of the astronomy branch of UNESCO. |
1.51
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> Anyone interested in fighting back against skies covered with more satellites than stars for no reason than market control of 3 billion people? No... My biggest problem is night time clouds and the moon... Can we get rid of those first? Rejection algorithms do wonders on satellites, but I can't for the life of me reject clouds. |
12.40
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Petition signed...I will forward it to all my friends in astronomical group also...thats a really nightmare !! "Chronicle of a tragedy foretold" ... |
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Signed as well, and good to see which Problems are there for Astronomers and beginners like me. Difficult is IMHO all the trash we produce around our Planet. For those who dont know stuff in space, here is the link: http://www.stuffin.space/ As i read it before here in this Thread, one of the greatest signs of human stupidity visible for all And, these Objects are not all, how much smaller pieces around, is not known and invisible for us. |
1.20
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Thanks! History often shows the general public not reacting until a crisis is reached. The new tabloid astronomy is pitching a farsical asteroid threat almost daily, among other things, desensitizing real issues affecting their lives. Some are, practically speaking, irreversible. Even among us, how many are even aware of this impending practical termination of the natural night sky? Yet the forum topic rates somewhere around a lens scratch (more accurately, 45,000.....). Most people, upon stumbling across the truth, pickup and hurry off as if nothing had happened. |
1.20
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Clouds? Move. Good areas, narrow band filters, and moon calendars still available. Everyone in on the digital eraser cover up team? |
9.85
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Signed as well |
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To see the enormity of the problem, goto http://celestrak.com and click on the real-time CelesTrak Orbit Visualization. From there you can see all of the satellites in orbit, debris or otherwise. You can also filter to see just the ones put up recently (Starlink)... |
3.21
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Thanks for the link, Brian. Now that is impressive - in a not so positive way... *sigh* I also signed the two petitions mentioned in this thread, but i doubt that these petitions will change anything |
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Also signed it an shared on a FB astro channel. |
1.81
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Signed and shared on Twitter |
8.04
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The petition was 512 when I first posted the link, it is now 609, so nearly a 100 have signed in the last week. Keep signing and getting your astro friends (and any-one else for that matter) to sign. Carole |
8.04
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Apparently another 60 satellites went up yesterday!!!! Carole |
8.04
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I have had the following reply back from ESA: Thanks for getting in touch about this issue. The topic is really active now, with many groups (ESO, AAS, RAS, IAU etc) involved, and in particular the Vera Rubin Observatory (aka LSST), which will be most affected from the optical contamination. I’d be happy to talk by phone / skype if you want to brainstorm some ideas on how to take some actions forward with respect to the amateur astronomy community. Let me know a good time for you. Best regards, Andy [b] [/b] Dr. Andy Williams External Relations Officer, Executive Office of the Director General European Southern Observatory (ESO), Karl-Schwarzschild-Str. 2, 85748 Garching, Germany Phone: +49-(0)89-3200-6278 | Mobile: +49-(0)151 4143 5065 Email: [url=mailto:[email protected]][email protected] [/url]I am going to see what we can come up with. Carole |
3.21
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Great news, Carole! |
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Randall Magnuson: From starlink.com: Starlink is on the leading edge of on-orbit debris mitigation, meeting or exceeding all regulatory and industry standards. At end of life, the satellites will utilize their on-board propulsion system to deorbit over the course of a few months. In the unlikely event the propulsion system becomes inoperable, the satellites will burn up in Earth’s atmosphere within 1-5 years, significantly less than the hundreds or thousands of years required at higher altitudes. |
8.04
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We're having a Skype call tomorrow. Will feedback results. Carole |
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Signed the petition but I fear that we won't be enough. Great that some of you got in contact with people of slightly more impact, but if money is one of the topics, it usually wins! Let;s cross some (many) fingers! |
8.04
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OK, I have had my Skype conversation with Andrew Williams at ESO (European Southern Observatory which runs the huge Telescope in the Atacama). He says because they are government funding as a body they can't make too much noise about it, but they are going to as individuals sign the petition. He says that they have been in contact with Space Ex who have put one satellite up with non reflective coating, as an experiment, but apparently that can cause it to overheat, so no guarantee this is going to be a solution. The satelittes are going into LEO 250kms initially and will probably end up at 500kms, so less visible visually, but of course makes a lot of difference to long exposure. We discussed the effect this will have on our hobby, the wasted money on Equipment if it can't be used any more, or re-sold because no-one else is going to want to buy it. We discussed the Retailers and manufacturers who will be affected/go out of business with lack of sales. Also the Remote observatories who might also lose/go out of business, and the places that host visitors for Astronomy such as the Place in Namibia, Olly Penrice's place in France, and AstroFarm ect etc. It was suggested that we all write to our MPs, sign petitions, contact other astronomers, and forums and All the Retailers that might be affected. he felt the loss of business was likely to have the most impact. Also post the petition and ideas on other forums around the world and enlist help and petition support. I don't have a comprehensive list of all this, so perhaps if we club together we can contact as many as possible and each let us know who they have done. I am not sure how this can be achieved, so I might contact Salvatore to find out how we can have a thread with page that can be added to and ticked, rather than a long thread. Watch this space (literally), in the meantime please add any Retailers and businesses you think might be affected. I will start with the following I am sure there are loads of other (please copy and paste the list and add any new ones until be find a better method) Retailers Manufacturers: Skywatcher Orion Celestron Teleskop service Atik Baader UK Retailers: First Light Optics Modern Astronomy 365 Astronomy Rother Valley Optics The Widescreen Centre Altair Astro Image Hosting Sites and holiday places: E Eye in Spain Deep sky West Les Granges Astronomy Centre in France Astrofarm Other forums: Cloudy Nights Ice In Space Astronomy Forum Star Gazers Lounge (I've already put the petition on there) What about APOD? Let me know your thoughts and if you're happy to Spread the word. Carole |