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There are so few clear nights in the winter time and it looks like a few are coming up soon for me. I'm looking at setting up outside in 1-3 F (-17 to -16C), remote connecting inside, and running a NUC outside with RDP instead of a pricey laptop. I just don't think I have the willpower to pass clear skies up. What I am curious about from the community is... for your average middle of the road mount with stock, from-the-factory grease, have you seen any impacts in your experience? Is that gallon special generic yellow stuff from the factory going to be be ok(ish), or is it going to gel up and stick my RA axis? Yeah, if I'm that serious about wanting to go out in the tundra, but do I really need to strip the mount down and put low temp grease in there? I'm curious, how absolutely necessary is cleaning and regreasing your mount with the premium low temp stuff from what you have seen? |
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| The answer from the few experiences I had is no, you don't need to do that at those temperatures. That is, if my mounts have the same grease yours have, of which I have no idea what they are. |
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| My EQ6-R works fine at -15°C without any modification.🙂 |
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| My AP Mach 1 works fine at those temperatures and my older Losmandy GM811G did fine also. |
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Hello all, I strongly advise to check the specification of the mount. The lubrication is certainly one very important factor, but not the only one. Also the mechanical play of gear changes depending on the different metals used. What is also very important is, that cold motors draw more power due to lower resistance. Also the electronics (board and hand pad) may have issues e.g. LCD displays are temperature sensitive. When I was using my old EQ8 it had severe issues below -10 degree (e.g. LCD display was not readable any more, gear was hard going). Now I am using a 10 Micron mount. It has a function to pre-heat the motors 120s before starting them. There is also a built in heating for the hand pad. If temperature drops below a certain threshold the mount shuts down automatically. Sometime mounts need special care when running below certain temps. e.g. 10 Micron mounts need a special low temp mod kit when running below -15 degree. To summarize: There are a quite few aspects to consider when running at very low temp. Electronic and mechanics will be impacted. CS Rüdiger |
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Robert Eder: Mine too! No worries with low temperatures, even DSLR withstands -10°C. Chris |
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I have a new CEM70 and only two opportunities to use it so far, and both short sessions. The first night was -10C and everything worked well until clouds shut me down after about an hour. The second night was colder, -15C, windy, and clouds rolling through, so not an imaging night but thought I’d get a little more learning time in. Conditions considered, the night started fine, but a couple hours in I was trying to re-start guiding and couldn’t because the guide star was drifting in DEC so fast that PHD2 would lose it almost immediately. I tried a couple times, and checked to make sure a cable wasn’t snagged, but couldn’t make it work and since the temperature was dropping, wind increasing and more clouds, I gave up and packed up. Anyhow, the behavior was as if the mount was getting a constant slew command in DEC and I wondered if the cold could have impacted the hand controller to cause that. I had the HC’s heater function turned on fwiw.I realize these conditions aren’t what the mount was designed for, but giving up any of the longest nights of the year…. Doesn’t help the learning curve, though, when you’re not sure if it’s the cold causing an issue, or something else you can address. Forecast for tonight is clear, calm, and -20C...... Cheers, Scott |
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Thanks everyone for your input. I have an EQ6R which is my go to mount that I don't have to fiddle with because it just works (other than polar align which those knobs and stiction can sometime be fussy). And a CGX which can be more tempermental mostly because I have to dial it in for longer focal length. I've never been able to work effecively in any brand of gloves for some of the fine tuning tasks either so the goal is to quickly balance, connect, align and get back in the house asap for the RDP show. I try to run all AC, no battery too when it gets to the extremes. It's going to be clear and calm for me as well tonight. For those also heading out tonight, good luck everyone on your arctic acquisition!  |
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I’ve been out this year and the last 2 times (nights) it was -19c & -23c respectively. I have an OnStep converted CGE Pro and CGX mounts. In my case my Pro worked very well but the problems I had was not mechanical. I personally feel it was all electrical. On several different occasions that night my cameras would disconnect and reconnect multiple times. If you used SharpCap then you know you have to close and restart your session and you know what kind of a pain that it! My CGX ran great up to about -10c when things started happening with the guiding so I just parked that mount and stayed with my main setup on my CGE Pro. In both my rigs I used AC to power everything I could and a large 38am/hr ion rechargeable battery. |
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Thanks everyone for your input. I have an EQ6R which is my go to mount that I don't have to fiddle with because it just works (other than polar align which those knobs and stiction can sometime be fussy). Not to digress, but one of my favorite things about the CEM70 is that the mount's azimuth adjustment is built into the base, so no stiction! The only fiddly part is locking the altitude adjustment without shifting the alignment a bit. Cheers, Scott |
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| One of the best lubricants for mounts, especially in cold environments, is Lubriplate 105 Motor Assembly Grease, available at most auto parts stores. It is in use on Software Bisque's Paramount line, and holds up well under even severe temperature fluctuations. |
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I took my iOptron Gem28 out last night with the prediction of clear skies, but the temp at the time of imaging was -9F / -22.8C and below average transparency.. but it has been so cloud covered for the last 6 weeks, I couldn't resist setting up. The mount worked perfectly for me. Never had tracking issues, guiding was great. Tonight looks to be clear and above average transparency! And, a low that is two degrees warmer than yesterday! what a treat. (-7F / -21.7C). Our high today is a balmy 0F / -17.8C XD So I will be setting up again tonight. I can't wait for temps to rise a bit and the clouds are not a nightly occurrence. Clear Skies and Stay Warm, Chase |
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Scott Badger:Thanks everyone for your input. I have an EQ6R which is my go to mount that I don't have to fiddle with because it just works (other than polar align which those knobs and stiction can sometime be fussy). Not a digress at all. I'm on the fence between a CEM70 and CEM120. I have about ~35lb rig that I know is within spec for the 70, but I didnt know if the CEM's follow the - don't even think about getting close to 50% of the rated capacity thing or if it is like the MyT where the spec is completely honored at 100%. The CGX squealed like a pig and started slipping at zenith with a WO FLT132 on first light. Now that's a digress! Lol! |
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Steve Solon and Terry Chatterton: Yep, funny enough, I bought a tube of it for that very reason and was why I wanted to post this question. It's just sitting their staring at me saying you really should use me. But the mess and tearing apart the CGX to clean the old grease. Hoping to be lazy for just a few of these bitter nights. Spring isnt that far away (and galaxy season!) My wife rolls her eyes at that. Both parts of my comment. |
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AstroDarkSky I don’t have enough experience of my own to speak to your question about capacity but FWIW when I spoke with someone at Ioptron he talked me out of getting the 120 for a similar payload weight that you have. Chase, were you using the hand controller in those temps? Seems like that would be first to fail…. Cheers, Scott |
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The lowest I have imaged in is -37c, so kinda cold. A few things to keep in mind are as previously mentioned the lubrication between the gears, and the effect temperature has on metal. If you can, ensure that your mount slews at a slower rate when its cold outside just to be safe. Dew heaters are a good thing to have as well because eventually the frost will start attacking at that low of a temperature. The other major consideration are the cables. They will get stiff and they can easily break. Make sure your cables are rated for that kind of temperature. Please do watch out for your own safety, even if its in your own back yard. Don't touch any of that metal with your bare hands. It's a great way to get frostbite. If you are as insane as I am and go to a dark site in below freezing temps, make sure you have sufficient shelter (even if its just sitting in your vehicle) and a way to make a fire if things hit the fan. Dress for the weather! Do your best to keep the battery as warm as you can. Ideally go with someone else and if not make sure where ever you are going has service so you can call for help if it comes to that. |
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It doesn’t get quite that cold here, but I regularly image at 15-20F (-5 to -10C). Losmandy G11 and Intel NUC work fine, but I’ve had troubles with my ZWO ASI120MM and EAF getting flakey when temps go below 20F (-7C). Note the specs says their operating range is -5C to 45C (not atypical for consumer electronics). Haven’t seen issues with the ASI1600MM Pro. I’ve tried insulating them with socks…I think that helps some, especially if I make sure to connect and get everything working and warmed up before it gets too cold. one thing that may be obvious…I make sure to tighten friction clamps on tripod legs, the set screws that hold the EAF to the focuser shaft, etc. |
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I can't for the life of me believe you guys are going out imaging with those temperatures. I'd beat a hasty retreat at anything below -10 degC, never mind minus something degF! In my own backyard, never mind further afield! My hat off to you, sirs! |
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Its calling for clear skies tonight for me here but I don’t think I’ll be going out. Temps are forecasted 0ºf to -2ºf at these temps my CGX got quite loud. I do like the suggestion above, slowing the slew speed down a bit! Dale |
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My Orion Atlas Pro works fine at -16C without changing the grease. When it’s so cold I usually move several times both axis manually before I start the mount, than I do the same with the handcontroller (in this way the grease and the motors became a bit warmer before I start imaging. My mount is always outside (sheltered ), but I alway take the handcontroller inside so it’s warm when I have to use it in the beginning (a bit laggy when very cold, but still working ok). |
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Scott Badger: Scott, Luckily I do not have to touch my hand controller, as you are right, the screen was basically frozen. ASIAir controls my mount through my mounts Wi-Fi, which was such a revelation when I figured how to do that! (I am within one year of astro-experience) andrea tasselli: I'll admit, it is not the most enjoyable thing, maybe it's becuase I am "Minnesotan" and used to these temps, it still sucks haha. But I haven't imaged in so long, and I still need to get a decent first image from my new ASI294MC Pro! These clouds suck |
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| I’m in Michigan and like you @Chase Newtson you get used to it. It does help to have it in my observatory. I have a small 4’x 8’ control room that I try to keep warm enough when my computers are running out there so that helps, but if I get everything all up and running then I go back into the house to stay warm when I can 😊 |
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Dale Penkala: Oh man Dale, I will not lie, I wish I had my own little observatory. One day... I 100% bet that makes a difference, becuase negative weather only really feels horrible when it has wind, and my backyard lies next to a wetlands, so there is often wind to really push that cold on you. |
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Chase Newtson:Dale Penkala: Agree 100% with the wind issues! I’m in the country with corn fields on my north, south & east sides of me so I get that! |
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I've had my EQ6-R with full rig* outside for the better part of the winter, temperatures ranging from +5 C° to -25 C°. It is inside a roll-off roof observatory, but with basically no insulation the temperature inside is approximately the same as outside. From what I can tell everything is working fine, I've had some inconsistencies with tracking but I can't say for sure if temperature has anything to do with it, it might as well be wind gusts catching the end of my OTA. I've only had issues with accessory equipment, such as the flat panel (i think the drive has issues in very cold temperatures, afaik LED's themselves should work fine in these temperatures). * EQ6-R Nikon D5300 ASI120MM Commercial miniPC |
